Investigative reporters Taya Graham and Stephen Janis report on the ground from Milwaukee, explaining what they heard from voters in this key swing state on Election Day and the lessons for Democrats as they try to rebuild and rebrand. Studio Production: Stephen Janis Additional Post-Production: Adam Coley Transcript The following is a rushed transcript and may contain errors. A proofread version will be made available as soon as possible. Taya Graham: Hello. This is Taya Graham and Stephen Janis on the ground covering the 2024 Wisconsin election. And most of us woke up to a decidedly different country. Donald Trump’s resounding victory exemplifies a nation that has shifted red and that seems unconcerned about Trump’s violent rhetoric and often racist statements. But our job is not to comment on President Donald Trump’s behavior, but rather to understand why people have embraced it. That’s why we’re out here today to discuss some of the voters we spoke to and what they had to say about his support. Stephen, I realized that this election was about to shift in a decidedly unexpected way when we were outside of Centennial Hall interviewing voters. Tell me about some of the things that you noticed. Stephen Janis: Well, yeah, we had a couple of people, random people that we just spoke to who had voted for Trump right in the heart of Milwaukee in a precinct that serves students from nearby Marquette University and University of Milwaukee. So I was a little stunned. I don’t know if you were, but I was, and I was also stunned by the reasoning. Taya Graham: And now let’s listen to a young woman explain why she voted for Donald Trump and her interesting reasoning on reproductive rights. Speaker 3: I voted for Donald Trump today. Yes. Taya Graham: Now there are a lot of different policies former President Trump has. Are there any of his policies that he had from the previous administration that you’d like to see him carry out if he has another term? Speaker 3: I actually have no idea. Taya Graham: Well, let me ask you like this. I’m just curious your thoughts on reproductive rights. Speaker 3: I think that one too, that one’s probably the most controversial topic that I can think of. I think everyone has a right in their own bodies. I did hear that Donald Trump was leaving it up to the states to be able to decide what is going to happen with abortion and those rights for women. I believe that women should have a choice, but I also feel like Donald Trump does a great job in leading our country, and I think overall his policies are a bit better structured than Kamala’s. I’m 50/50 on that one, but I do believe that overall he would be the better candidate for our country. Taya Graham: My very last question, you mentioned that there are other policies of his that you think are good compared to Harris. Maybe you could just give me an example of one, because I can understand reproductive choice being a controversial one. Is there one that you like more than what Vice President Harris is offering? Speaker 3: I’m not sure on policies exactly. I think regarding the border, I do get concerned that there are so many people entering our country with access to a lot of things that I think US citizens don’t have access to. So I do believe in cracking down on the border and making it a little bit more strict on who could be in our country and what they have access to. Taya Graham: And then we had an encounter with a young man who had an unusual reason for voting for President Donald Trump. Take a listen. So Brian, can you tell me what issue was important to you that brought you out to the polls today? Brian: So I’m a California… I’m originally from California, and I think immigration is one of the bigger issues, but apart from that, I’ve just noticed a lot of changes that I don’t like with regard to the media I typically consume, not news and stuff, but just artistic stuff or creative things. And I’ve just noticed a shift from creativity to towing the party line or the social line, whatever is acceptable in the social context, and I don’t like it. Sorry. Taya Graham: Wow, that’s interesting. So when you’re talking about creativity media, are you talking about content creators, people who talk online, or are you literally describing visual media? Brian: Visual media would be a really good example. For example, Lord of the Rings, that’s the one that really comes to mind right now because I just watched a video last night about it. Taya Graham: Do you mean the Lord of the Rings that Amazon produced? Brian: Yes. Taya Graham: So what did you take issue with? Brian: I don’t like how the original content produced by Tolkien has been changed to fit the social narrative that is accepted today. I don’t know. Taya Graham: Okay, that’s fine. So let me see if I can guess. Does that mean you didn’t like seeing a black lady dwarf? Brian: No. That’s not why. Taya Graham: Oh, oh. Then I’m confused. Brian: That is part of it though. Taya Graham: Oh, okay. Brian: Because it’s not necessarily that she’s a black lady dwarf, it’s just… It’s actually not even that, it’s just the creators of the current Lord of the Rings show have subplanted the original content in favor of pushing real life issues such as minority representation, LGBTQ. Those things, yes, they’re important, but they don’t really have a place in… This is about elves, orcs, and dwarves fighting and stuff. What does this have to do with the current zeitgeist? I watch that stuff because I want to get away from what is currently happening. I don’t want to always be bombarded with this stuff. Taya Graham: I see what you’re saying. You’re looking for an escape, not another interpretation that brings in present day issues. Brian: Yeah, we watch movies because we want to be taken away from where we are. Taya Graham: You mentioned immigration. I’m curious, whose immigration policy do you prefer? Brian: I prefer Trump’s. Taya Graham: You prefer Trump’s. And may I ask what you’re hoping will be done at the border? Brian: More control. Yeah. Taya Graham: Now, there was a mention of a deportation of nearly 20 million people. What kind of impact do you think that might have on our economy? I mean, just as an example, California in the agricultural sector, undocumented as well as documented folks working to put food on our tables is anywhere between 40 to 60% depending on what type of crop it is. So don’t you see there might be a possible economic impact or do you think that that will be offset in some kind of way? Brian: There’s definitely going to be an economic impact and it’ll probably probably be pretty severe initially, but I think we’ll adjust. Taya Graham: So Stephen, these young people, they’re part of what’s known as Generation Z. Correct? So these folks, what did you think of their reasoning? I was somewhat surprised by some of the cultural reasons that were suggested as well. Stephen Janis: Yeah, it seemed very detached from policy and specifically understanding mechanics of policy, and more based on what people have been talking about, vibes. But I think there’s a reason for that. I think partially it has to do with the media ecosystem that younger people are immersed in like TikTok where it’s very hard to sort of parse a very complex policy decision. Like the young woman talking about the fact that Donald Trump had returned it to the states even though that had meant that 20 states now literally banned abortion, and she seemed not to be cognizant of that. And conversely, the young man who seemed to be, I guess, focused on the Lord of the Rings as- Taya Graham: Right. It was interesting because the word he wouldn’t use, but I knew was there, was woke. And his concern was that his art, his visual culture had been affected by politics, had been affected by what he considered an agenda. He mentioned specifically LGBTQ issues and racial issues that he felt were present-day issues that he didn’t want in his art. He wanted to escape, he said. But I think he was genuinely uncomfortable with modern-day issues being represented in art. But however, isn’t that what always happens with art? Isn’t the modern-day always reflected in an interpretation of any sort of creative project, whether it’s a book that’s being adapted or a movie? Right? Stephen Janis: Yeah. I mean, well art is technically supposed to be mimetic that is reflective of the society from which it is created. But I think there’s also another aspect of that. I think we’re dealing with what would be the first-generational inequality election where the Democratic Party turned away from Bernie Sanders and kind of became a corporatist entity, even though really technically the Biden administration moved significantly from the idea of neoliberalism. I think that what happened was we have departed from serious policy discussion to a more ephemera. And obviously, these students to me who should be able to grasp it, were not able to grasp the technical or sort of the specifics of policy. And I think that’s why they voted basically on more like a TikTok meme or something. Taya Graham: And it’s not just TikTok’s fault. There are plenty of other areas of our social media ecosystem that have essentially flattened the conversation. It’s very difficult to have a nuanced when you’ve got a one-minute or a three-minute deadline. Stephen Janis: Let me ask you a question. As a woman, you saw the young woman saying, “Well, he turned over abortion rights to the states.” How did you feel about that? Taya Graham: Well, I was somewhat shocked that she so deeply misunderstood the policy, whether one is for or against women having the right to choose, to state that turning it over to each individual state to decide means that it will interfere with a woman’s right to choose if that’s what you want. And in this woman’s case, she thinks women should have the right to choose. So her not realizing turning it over to the states actually resulted in abortion bans across the board, it was somewhat disappointing. Stephen Janis: And that’s something we’ve talked about and we talked about after several debates, we have discussed at the Real News the disconnect between policy and people’s perception of how things work is really vast. I mean, we’ve had the Infrastructure Act, we’ve had the Inflation Reduction Act, very specific policies that have benefited people. We have one of the strongest economies in the world right now. We do have the strongest economy- Taya Graham: Recovered from COVID in a way other nations could only dream from. Stephen Janis: Yep, and low unemployment and all these things. And it hasn’t resonated with people. I understand inflation. I mean, I personally understand inflation, but even inflation is down now and still people think this country is somehow wrongly positioned. And so I think we’re dealing with a different political reality that the old formulas won’t work. Taya Graham: Well, it’s interesting because so many people that are Republican, I would say, want smaller government, and yet at the same time expect the government to fix our grocery bills. So it’s kind of a conundrum. If you want smaller government, then you can’t expect government to fix all of your problems. Stephen Janis: Well, you make a really good point. No one in the mainstream media ever pushed back on the Republicans when they said, “We’re going to lower inflation.” But how? I mean, it’s the Fed that controls the money supply and the Fed that controls interest rates, which ultimately control how the economy responds to monetary incentives. So it really, no one ever pushed back on Republicans and said, “How are you going to solve inflation?” But we do not want to end this totally on a bad note, right? Taya Graham: We don’t want to end this on a negative note either, throwing accusations at any party. What we would like to do is celebrate some of the first-time voters, because one thing that we can all feel good about is people becoming civically engaged as first-time voters. Whether they’re 18 or 80, we’re happy to see it. May I have your first name, please? Jasmine: Jasmine. Taya Graham: And I heard that you’re a first-time voter, is that correct? Jasmine: Yes, it is. Taya Graham: And so what brought you out today? What brought you out? What was important to you? Why does this election matter to you? Jasmine: It matters to me because I was able to make a choice. I was able to take my own thoughts and what I felt and take it in and be able to really show it in the world in a way. Hold on. Us younger folks really can’t. So definitely that, being able to use my voice. Taya Graham: Now as a first-time voter, I heard the whole room burst into applause for you. How did that feel? How did it feel actually seeing everybody celebrate you? Jasmine: It’s exciting. You don’t get it much, so it was definitely warming. It was okay, I’m being heard. This is the first step, this is the first thing. So it was exciting, it was warming. I want people to know that it’s okay to have your own opinion, to not follow by anybody else’s thoughts or comments, anything. We have our own opinion, we have our own choice. So I feel that’s the biggest thing right now. Stephen Janis: Taya, it was really… When you’re actually in the polling place, when someone votes for the first time, they applaud. And it was really… Taya Graham: [inaudible 00:12:32] applause. It was beautiful. Stephen Janis: And it was nice because these were very enthusiastic young people who really were glad to be engaged. And it was heartwarming. No matter what happens in election, whatever outcome you feel, it’s always good to see that we can still participate in this process. Right? Taya Graham: Absolutely. And we saw some really adorable young children with their parents, and it was just so lovely to see them be interested in the process. And of course, those 18-year-olds voting for the first time, they seemed a little shy, but I could tell they loved the attention. So it turns out you voters have something kind of special about you. What’s a little bit different about you folks? Speaker 6: First time voters. Taya Graham: And are you excited to be a first time voter? Speaker 7: Yes, I am. Taya Graham: So was there anything in particular that brought you out that you’re excited about this election? Speaker 8: No. I don’t know. I didn’t know what to say. Taya Graham: Well, as a first time voter, is there any particular… As a first time voter, is there any particular issue that’s very important to you? Speaker 6: Just want to make the environment better. Taya Graham: Okay. And for you, is there a position that matters to you? Any particular policy? Speaker 7: No policy, but besides the president, don’t forget about the legislative branches and all the other branches. Taya Graham: That’s an excellent point. The down ballot really does matter. Now, can I ask you a question? Would you be willing to share with me who you voted for? Speaker 7: Kamala Harris. Speaker 6: Kamala Harris. Speaker 8: Kamala Harris. Taya Graham: So Stephen, before we go, there’s one thing I had to ask. For those who were supporting progressive policies, those who were Democrats or even further on the left, is there anything for them to be optimistic about? Stephen Janis: Well, I’m going to put a pessimistic, optimistic view on this. No, but seriously, so I think Trump is going to execute some really damaging policies that are really going to hurt all of us and we’re all going to suffer. But maybe out of that we’ll realize the value of progressive policymaking. And maybe through that we’ll understand how important it is to embrace the complexity of progressive policies. And we’ll see that it really isn’t great to vote on a vibe and to vote for someone who really has, I think, bad policy chops. And we will learn what happens when that person is allowed to execute those policies. So I think the silver lining is that we can hopefully… Out of what happens post… Once Trump is president, we can actually see how valuable it is to talk about good policy and be progressives. And I think that’s really, really important. Get past some of the things that hold back the left and the Democrats and actually say, “You know what? We can create great policies that can make for a better country.” So I hope that’s kind of optimistic, not terribly optimistic, but somewhat. Taya Graham: Well, Steven, I hope your optimism is able to reach people because I know there are a lot of people out there right now that are absolutely heartbroken. And then of course, there are people out there who are celebrating. All we can hope is that as a country we can find some way to move forward in a united fashion. This is Taya Graham and Stephen Janis reporting for the Real News Network in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Speaker 9: Thank you so much for watching The Real News Network where we lift up the voices, stories, and struggles that you care about most. And we need your help to keep doing this work. So please tap your screen now, subscribe, and donate to the Real News Network. Solidarity forever.